Ultimate 747

Connections List
 * Against Christianity
 * Occams Razor

This is by Richard Dawkins from The God Delusion, parody/resposne to the 747 argument in favor of Gods existence.

Essentially, the creationist argues that the cosmological dials and life forming is as probable as setting off an explosion in a parts warehouse and getting a fully functioning Boeing 747. Dawkins turns this around and says that if the construction arm of evolution and such didn't do it, then God had to. If God did it, he has to be more complicated than it. But to suppose his existence is even harder than a 747. God is the ultimate 747. For God to occured out of the universe, such incredible odds would have to be in his favor, at least a little more than just the universe, its cosmological dials, life, etc.

Theist Response: I assume Dawkins is not grossly misunderstanding majority Christian beliefs, but if he is, let's clarify: God was first, not the universe. We don't believe in matter existing before God which could have created him. A similar belief with the same result - God never began. He's always existed. These beliefs may have their own problems, but the ultimate 747 is not one of them.

This argument then directs us to Occams razor and the question as to whether assuming God first (though we claim to have evidence of Gods existence) or the universe first (though they claim to have evidence of the universes beginning...if that's pertinent) is simpler. Reminder: these are aguments of preference, not absolutism. To show that God is more complicated only makes atheism preferred (at least by one measure) than theism with lack of evidence. But considering we both claim to have some... it's still fun to talk about.

The multiverse does not help atheism become simpler. In fact it might make it more complicated. Possible escapes could lie in multiverse origins to the big bang (massive infitesimal points, which are conceptually simple, or other conceptually simple things).